The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Komrade Kharloth on Thu Oct 25, 2012 7:28 pm

What world are you living in?

http://www.reddit.com/r/atheism/comments/vubyx/only_a_tiny_minority_of_extremists/

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Mr. Wiggles on Thu Oct 25, 2012 8:12 pm

Have you read those studies?

"The ICM opinion poll also indicates that a fifth have sympathy with the "feelings and motives" of the suicide bombers who attacked London last July 7, killing 52 people, although 99 per cent thought the bombers were wrong to carry out the atrocity."

Many of the sources you offer are fundamentally flawed some are just webpages with no sources or otherwise blatantly bias surveys (EG A Israeli survey about an Israeli family's murder which asks only one thousand Palestinians, seriously?) and are not in the least bit reputable, other surveys whilst asking a wide range of questions turn complex affairs into yes or no, losing much in the process. Many of the latter are conducted by news papers who by the sources own admission "makes for a dramatic headline" but not much else.

Moving on:
"91 per cent still say they feel loyal to Britain."

"Muslims who are 30 or older, by contrast, just 6% say suicide bombings can be often or sometimes justified, while 82% say such attacks are never warranted."

"While this is mainly a peaceful and productive immigrant population... British intelligence services estimated that one percent of British Muslims either support or are involved in terrorism."

"America's fastest-growing religion is Islam, but here in the States the numbers are not a security concern, as a commitment to Islam has not overwhelmed a strong attachment to America itself — another victory for the cultural melting pot."
Regardless, even much of the evidence (legitimate and illegitimate) refutes your point. The tables provided in one source state that the majority of American Muslims strongly disagree with Al-Qaeda and that bombing is never justified, even more Muslims agree that Israel and Palestine can co-exist through diplomacy.

A tiny minority of extremists is completely accurate and whilst you can find a thousand studies that say this and that, what none of them say mention is a "majority of extremists". That is your own invention. You see the figure 5% and assume that is indicative of some greater unrest, 25% undecided means exactly that. So what if they some dislike America or disagree with the treatment of Muslim clerics, you are missing the point entirely if you think that this means they would murder because of it. The funny thing is as well that even with all of those studies all they can do is say that a minority of Middle Easterners, not American, not British, but Middle Eastern hold extremist and in some cases pro-terrorist views.

My only surprise was that even studies show that the entirety of the Middle East isn't a gang of balaclava militants pointing their RPG's at America.

Whilst there is a discontented minority, if anything your evidence illustrates that you have either not read or failed to understand the studies in question and that ultimately, Islam is a peaceful religion. Although some who hold Islamic beliefs are not peaceful, but I think the world figured that out by now.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Komrade Kharloth on Thu Oct 25, 2012 9:10 pm

http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-survey-research-from-a-british-islamist

What about this one, where a report by the guardian (hardly an inflammatory anti-muslim newspaper) Found that;
>Disagree with the idea that Muslims should inform on people who are
involved or connected with terrorist activities: 25 percent.
>Agree that despite the right to free speech, in Britain, those who
insult or criticise Islam should face criminal prosecution: 58 percent.
>Say that the Muslim Council of Britain Muslim generally does not reflect his or her views: 45 percent.

Or this one http://www.macdonaldlaurier.ca/much-good-news-and-some-worrying-results-in-new-study-of-muslim-public-opinion-in-canada/
Which says that 35% of Canadian muslims don't totally reject Al-Qaeda.

"Muslims who are 30 or older, by contrast, just 6% say suicide bombings
can be often or sometimes justified, while 82% say such attacks are
never warranted."
What about the part that shows younger muslims believe the opposite?
>France: only 57% of muslims aged 18-29 believe that suicide bombings are never justifiable.
>Spain: 65% of younger muslims believe that suicide bombings are never justifiable.
>Britain: Where that 82% never justifiable drops to 59% among 18-29 year olds.

Older muslims might be more loyal to Britain, but the new generation of Muslims are becoming increasingly radicalized.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by PayJ on Thu Oct 25, 2012 9:14 pm

To be honest the same could be said for our youth. Just instead of blowing the fuck out of innocents we build and a tent city and whine.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by owyn_merrilin on Thu Oct 25, 2012 9:20 pm

PayJ wrote:To be honest the same could be said for our youth. Just instead of blowing the fuck out of innocents we build and a tent city and whine.

Well hell, when you put it that way, maybe the muslims have the right idea. God knows the occupy movement doesn't have any idea what they want to do, just that they want things to be different from how they are now.
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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Mr. Wiggles on Thu Oct 25, 2012 9:46 pm

I could write a decent argument but to be quite frank, it is not worth it. Those who pose a threat are still a minority. Not only that, the studies prove that only a small age group of Muslims are affected. They are a tiny fraction of a fraction who yet again do not in the slightest admit to being terrorists but they think some causes are worth suicide bombing for. Does that make them terrorists? 46% of Britons support Nuclear weapons. Why is that not outrageous?

Also, interesting you refer to Pipes who is described as having an "obsessive hatred of all things Muslim" and as an "anti-Arab propagandist" who has built a career out of "distortions... twist[ing] words, quot[ing] people out of context and stretch[ing] the truth to suit his purpose." He was barred from the University of Toronto after professors, staff and students asserted that Pipes had a "long record of xenophobic, racist and sexist speech that goes back to 1990". He has also claimed Obama is funded by the PLO. There is a long rap sheet against this man and as I say I can't be arsed to share all of it, when we both have wikipedia.

Continuing on, the quote from the MacDonald Laurier study is as follows
"The most encouraging finding is the pervasive repudiation of Al Qaeda. The late Osama bin Laden’s organization is fully rejected by 65% (score of 1), supported fully by 1% (score of 7), and supported partially or tolerated by the remaining 34%."

Wow. So what if Muslims don't totally reject Al Qaeda? That just means they don't have a strong viewpoint on the matter. It sure as shit doesn't mean they're just indecisive terrorists.

It's the same situation again. Surveys which make implications about a minority of Muslims and biased articles claiming it to be proof of some Jihad against the West.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Mr. Wiggles on Thu Oct 25, 2012 9:49 pm

Honestly man, how can you believe a word that pillock says when he thinks "More Survey Research from a British Islamist Hell" is an appropriate title?

Utter tripe.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Mr. Wiggles on Thu Oct 25, 2012 10:00 pm

And on the subject of Candian Muslims, I missed this earlier but only 1% support Al Qaeda strongly while 2% support the group to an extent. Compare that to the 65% who out right oppose Al Qaeda, the statistics speak for themselves.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Hubilub on Thu Oct 25, 2012 11:16 pm

There are three types of lies: Lies, damned lies, and statistics.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Guest on Fri Oct 26, 2012 5:02 am

Komrade Kharloth wrote:http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-survey-research-from-a-british-islamist

What about this one, where a report by the guardian (hardly an inflammatory anti-muslim newspaper) Found that;
>Disagree with the idea that Muslims should inform on people who are
involved or connected with terrorist activities: 25 percent.
>Agree that despite the right to free speech, in Britain, those who
insult or criticise Islam should face criminal prosecution: 58 percent.
>Say that the Muslim Council of Britain Muslim generally does not reflect his or her views: 45 percent.

Or this one http://www.macdonaldlaurier.ca/much-good-news-and-some-worrying-results-in-new-study-of-muslim-public-opinion-in-canada/
Which says that 35% of Canadian muslims don't totally reject Al-Qaeda.

"Muslims who are 30 or older, by contrast, just 6% say suicide bombings
can be often or sometimes justified, while 82% say such attacks are
never warranted."
What about the part that shows younger muslims believe the opposite?
>France: only 57% of muslims aged 18-29 believe that suicide bombings are never justifiable.
>Spain: 65% of younger muslims believe that suicide bombings are never justifiable.
>Britain: Where that 82% never justifiable drops to 59% among 18-29 year olds.

Older muslims might be more loyal to Britain, but the new generation of Muslims are becoming increasingly radicalized.
You fall within the 18 - 29 bracket for non-muslims. I don't know but it seems you hold some pretty radical views of your own.

18 - 29 year olds, by and large, have always been fucking idiots. That's why its possible to have people going off fighting wars. We're easily radicalized and easily angered.

If the commonwealth were to go to war, and bring about the draft, you and I would probably be called up. We'd go off and kill some slightly different peoples children, probably feel justified and seem like monsters to other people.

So whats the difference between us and these Muslim boys/men exactly?

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Hubilub on Fri Oct 26, 2012 10:04 am

I'm with Stinky Wiggles here, if there's one thing you shouldn't trust it's statistics in the hands of an extreme right winger. Muslims are -not- violent, radicalized people. I really think you're blowing this way out of proportions.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Terria on Fri Oct 26, 2012 11:52 am

Stinky Wiggles is what I call my penis.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Furburt on Fri Oct 26, 2012 3:32 pm





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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by MilkyFresh on Fri Oct 26, 2012 3:36 pm

wat

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Guest on Fri Oct 26, 2012 3:53 pm


Fantastic.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Furburt on Fri Oct 26, 2012 4:03 pm

They all look doped except for the tall guy with the headdress. And of course, crazy eyes on the left.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Terria on Fri Oct 26, 2012 4:07 pm

Guy on the right looks like he's in the middle of a bad Bill Cosby impression.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Guest on Fri Oct 26, 2012 5:07 pm

Guy on the right pretending he has a gun.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by MilkyFresh on Fri Oct 26, 2012 5:25 pm

Whoa

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by PayJ on Fri Oct 26, 2012 5:41 pm

The guy on the left looks like he just saw the whitey that hit him with a stick.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by PayJ on Fri Oct 26, 2012 5:42 pm

stinkychops wrote:
Fantastic.

New Smiley.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Xandy on Fri Oct 26, 2012 6:53 pm

New avatar.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Furburt on Fri Oct 26, 2012 11:31 pm

Those are Baluba tribesmen from the Congo. Irish troops were with the UN when they were there in the mid-60's so you get lots of old guys in Dublin pubs going on and on about the ferocity of the Balubas.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Hubilub on Sat Oct 27, 2012 6:22 pm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Last_Temptation_of_Christ_%28film%29#Controversy

Bloody muslims, getting all violent over a mov-Oh wait.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Komrade Kharloth on Sat Oct 27, 2012 8:19 pm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reactions_to_Innocence_of_Muslims

Totally the same thing.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Alkaline on Thu Nov 01, 2012 10:54 am

http://openchannel.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/10/27/14703406-in-mali-land-of-gangster-jihadists-ransoms-help-fuel-the-movement

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Guest on Thu Nov 01, 2012 12:49 pm

Komrade Kharloth wrote:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reactions_to_Innocence_of_Muslims

Totally the same thing.
"Greece
About 600 Muslim protestors in Athens tried to march on the U. S. Embassy, but were stopped by Greek police. No injuries were reported, although three cars were damaged and three storefronts were smashed. The protestors chanted "we are all with Osama" and called on the US to hang the filmmaker.[49]"

Dead at the bottom of the ocean, deserted by your make believe god?

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Walnutman on Fri Nov 02, 2012 6:20 pm

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-20165371

So yeah.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by PayJ on Fri Nov 02, 2012 6:45 pm

They know what they are doing.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Komrade Kharloth on Mon Nov 05, 2012 11:27 pm

US Election tomorrow.



Why the fuck doesn't Romney grow a mustache, looks much more professional and less sleazy.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Komrade Kharloth on Mon Nov 05, 2012 11:42 pm

Oh yeah, and Montreal is probably going to be facing a mob war shortly.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Hubilub on Tue Nov 06, 2012 12:06 am

So some woman beat her 7-year old son to death because he couldn't learn the Quran by heart

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Komrade Kharloth on Tue Nov 06, 2012 12:16 am

It's a big fucking book and not exactly easy for children to comprehend.

Fucking Islamists.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Hubilub on Tue Nov 06, 2012 10:42 pm

Maaaaan, Swedes don't know anything about America at all

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Komrade Kharloth on Tue Nov 06, 2012 11:14 pm

Why?

I sense there's a news story behind that post.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Hubilub on Wed Nov 07, 2012 12:05 am

They just don't get how anyone could be anything other than a raging hard liberal. People complain about America having a two-party system, but damn it, at least there's ideological diversity. In Sweden, everything is liberal. As is the media. And so everything people hear and read is liberal propaganda, and whenever people on the streets are interviewed about America all they can say is that "Republicans are evil sexist racists." There is absolutely no attempt at trying to clear up the massive, repeat, MASSIVE amounts of misconceptions about America in this country.

It's embarrassing to turn on the news or go to a Swedish newspapers website to try and get information on the election and be bombared with nothing but liberal views

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Komrade Kharloth on Wed Nov 07, 2012 12:25 am

It's the same here.

Every. Single. Person. Hates Romney, without actually knowing anything about the politics of either candidate, they just think that he's going to set back women's/civil rights/labour laws 100 years.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Komrade Kharloth on Wed Nov 07, 2012 12:26 am

Also, fuck people who vote based a single social issue.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Hubilub on Wed Nov 07, 2012 12:57 am

2008 election: Obama is against gay marriage.

People don't give a shit.

2012 election: Obama is for gay marriage.

"THOSE WHO DON'T SUPPORT GAY MARRIAGE ARE EVIL!"

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

Post by Guest on Wed Nov 07, 2012 4:37 am

Komrade Kharloth wrote:US Election tomorrow.



Why the fuck doesn't Romney grow a mustache, looks much more professional and less sleazy.
Commissioner Gordon.

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Re: The News Thread! 2nd Edition!

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